Packaging and Price Point?

[afilter]

So, has it been decided how this game will be packaged...aka content?   I know I read the price point is still being worked on based on the direction the minis go pre-painted vs. unpainted material and such.

The reason I ask is I am very excited about this game.  With all the games that are out there I think Leviathans really has an opportunity to appeal to both historical wargamers as well as fantasy gamers.  I would categorize myself as a historical gamer with little or no interest anymore in fantasy.  The back story has been done so well that Leviathans has my full attention.

My concern is that to give this game everything it deserves in terms of quality it will price it beyond many casual gamers means that might otherwise be interested. 

I posed the question on a couple other game forums I frequent...What is the most you would pay for a game you no little about, but looks interesting on an impulse buy?  So far the response is Under $40.  Obviously there is no way this game could be done for that with quality minis at 1/1200 scale painted or not.  My guess is double that price or more and I think that might cost out many potential players

My proposal would be to look at another option for packaging the game.  Consider releasing a core set that includes the rules, dice, maps etc but not the minis.  Instead include some quality cardboard conters.  Keep the price point in the $30-40 range with quality artwork etc.  At the same time release the planned quality minis as seperate expansion as either fleet sets or individual units priced accordingly.  Include a catalog of the available minis in the core set.  I think the game would draw more casual gamers who are browsing at the LGS as well as satisfy all of us who are already sold on the game.

I look at the Wings of War game as a model.  The box sets play great as stand alone games, but then you buy the minis and it takes the game to a whole new level.  If someone is insistant on a complete set then do a delux set that maybe includes all the minis as well as a few extras with a price to match.

I am sure this game will sell, but my concern is will it sell enough to make it last down the long run.  If released as seperate components I think more will be drawn in.  The customers will be given the opportunity to break up the overall cost of the game with a few purchases once they have the core set and are sold on the game.  This way more items will sell to both the hardcore enthusiast as well as others who buy in and get hooked becuae the price is initially right.

I initially bought into Wings of War for $30 while I was browsing and did not know much about the game...I now own hundreds $ of WoW products.  If Wo initially came with a bunch of Minis for $80 I probably would have passed.

Any thoughts?

What is your personal price point to buy a game you know little about, but looks good when browsing?

[Toolian]

First we must establish we are throwing prices out there.

But in comparison with other games I am going to say the core set will be 60 bucks give or take 15.

We have to remember factory deals are not even set.

From the one preview mini the quality is obviously better than WaS. I am happy with the quality and level of the WaS minis, the only exception is the materials used for Destroyers. A very soft plastic that bends. Though, Richard Baker told me this was not a result of saving money. It was to prevent ships breaking in 2. The soft rubber has more elasticity than a hard plastic miniature, such as the plastic wings on the WoW wings (fuselage made of metal).

Your one proposal seemed nice

Rules and map pack - 30 bucks

faction box set 30 (for each faction)

or a complete box set for 80 (again we are throwing numbers here, this discussion is not so much of what you are willing to pay, but how can you effectively package them)

If a person only intends to play a single faction this could save him money.

I am sure CGL is doing the market research and is doing the right thing.... 

[afilter]

I am sure CGL is doing the market research and is doing the right thing.... 

I would certainly hope so...More of a curiosity thing for me as well as wondering what direction CGL is looking toward.

Other than AAM/W@S and WoW I have not bought many other games in the past few years.  Recently I started aquiring some older games I use to have and then looking at new boxed games.  Frankly I was shocked that there is not much out there under the $50-60 range for a stand alone game and many much more.  I new certain games like A&A were that much, but they is a pretty well branded item.

If not for discounted prices through some online sources and local discounts at the LGS I know I would not be able to justify some of my own expeditures.

Yes, No one knows on price yet....Based on what we have seen I can only imagine based on the quality of other games and price ranges.  I truly hope CGL can surprise us.

[grabula]

50-60 seems to be the target price point for "starters".  I think the CBT intro box is about that isn't it? I'd think it's going to be in line with that game since it's effectively the same type of deal from what I understand, basic rules, maps and miniatures in a nice box.  The CBT box was a fantastic deal and I believe most companies shoot to keep the price as low as possible on starter sets and charge more for additional sets and products.

[First Sea Lord Randall Bills]

Just dropping in a note that we've looked at several options along the lines of what is being discussed here. I'm a firm believer in nothing is off the table until the product is starting on a press, so we'll keep banging on this to come up with the coolest and best ways to present the opening salvo for this game and universe.

Thanks for the interest and suggestions.


Randall

[Trenchknife]

I'd be OK with a $60 starter IF AND ONLY IF that set had plastic/metal minis in it.  However, having seen the great work that was the latest boxed starter set for Battletech, with all the luscious plastics IT had in it for $40, I'd have to see further justification than just a few BIG minis in the box to rate the price hike.

Otherwise I'd be fine with quality color cardstock ships in the box if it kept the price low.

[afilter]

Otherwise I'd be fine with quality color cardstock ships in the box if it kept the price low.

This was along my line of thought, but definately provide those high end minis at the same time as an optional add on.  My thought is that initially you might get more people into the game that have not been following the development online and they will come back for the sexy minis when they see how good the mechanics and storyline are in the core set.

[Meatshield]

I think miniatures are a strong selling point, and my local game store largely has people pick up games because they like the look and feel of minis. The reasoning seems to be, even if you dislike the game after playing the starter, you have awesome minis. You'll find a use for them someday.

That cheap bendy plastic is not a good thing. It's more durable, yeah. But Polystyrene or that new plastic Privateer Press uses for WM/H are both durable as hell and capable of holding far more detail. And they don't warp nearly as much.

[Toolian]

Yup, minis are a selling point. Something people love to hold and touch. Remember love is touchy, feely subject... 

Where Afilter lies is that breaking them up to smaller packages will be less intimidating for many buyers.

A person is more willing to pull out 30 bucks for a basic game that can be expanded (if he wishes) Than say 60, 70, 80 for something that he may touch once and that is it.

I do not work for CGL, so I don't know what is more cost efficient, but as I have said, I am sure they have done their homework on what is best for the fans and company.

[Trenchknife]

Don't get me wrong.  I love the look of these things and WANT the minis.  The cardstock idea was more for the starter box.  However, most new games are coming stocked with miniatures in their initial boxes so to directly compete...you need minis in the box.

[Toolian]

Don't get me wrong.  I love the look of these things and WANT the minis.  The cardstock idea was more for the starter box.  However, most new games are coming stocked with miniatures in their initial boxes so to directly compete...you need minis in the box.

I am more for everything in the box, but I am probably in a different circumstance than many.


But minis in the box is not a must. Take a look at Wings of War, one of the more successful games out there.

The starters are cards. If you want minis you buy them. As it stands they are currently printing their 4th or 5th run of series 1.

[afilter]

Don't get me wrong.  I love the look of these things and WANT the minis.  The cardstock idea was more for the starter box.  However, most new games are coming stocked with miniatures in their initial boxes so to directly compete...you need minis in the box.

I am more for everything in the box, but I am probably in a different circumstance than many.


But minis in the box is not a must. Take a look at Wings of War, one of the more successful games out there.

The starters are cards. If you want minis you buy them. As it stands they are currently printing their 4th or 5th run of series 1.

Glad to see you are coming around....

[Trenchknife]

...Take a look at Wings of War, one of the more successful games out there.

The starters are cards. If you want minis you buy them. As it stands they are currently printing their 4th or 5th run of series 1.

I've never heard of this game.

[Toolian]

...Take a look at Wings of War, one of the more successful games out there.

The starters are cards. If you want minis you buy them. As it stands they are currently printing their 4th or 5th run of series 1.

I've never heard of this game.

Should take a look into it, has a large following across the world.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvUBGS5ZWos

[afilter]

Yes, Wings of war is huge....produced by Nexus and distributed by FFG in the U.S.  It is based on WWI and now WWII aerial combat.  Started with a simple WWI box set for MSRP of $29 and then added 1/144 very high quality affordable aircraft minis.  Currently they have five box sets(3 WWI, 2 WWII), two deluxe sets and 4 sets of 12 minis.  Two more box sets and two more sets of minis are due out this year along with a special addition large scale mini set(balloons).

I could really see Leviathans packaging and price points being modeled after Wings of War.    You can have a great time playing wings of war with just one of the box sets.  Add additional box sets and the Minis and you have a very visual simple Aerial wargame that really draws attention at the LGS.  Wings of War is one reason I am here.  I enjoy Naval wargaming and Aerial wargaming, so Leviathans could be the best of both.